Hitachi Vantara Pentaho Community Forums
Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: Get rid of Chef?

  1. #1
    Matt Casters Guest

    Default Get rid of Chef?

    Hi Kettle devs,

    Now that we have all sorts of tabs in Spoon, how about adding 3 as well:
    ChefGraph, ChefLog, ChefHistory?
    That way we can get rid of Chef and save us some duplication and a few
    thousand lines of code.

    Thoughts?

    Matt
    ____________________________________________
    Matt Casters, Chief Data Integration
    Pentaho, Open Source Business Intelligence
    http://www.pentaho.org <http://www.pentaho.org/> -- mcasters (AT) pentaho (DOT) org
    Tel. +32 (0) 486 97 29 37



    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

  2. #2
    Roland Bouman Guest

    Default Re: Get rid of Chef?

    Happy new year!

    Uhm...feels odd to be the first one to dig in, but I'd say: Go for It!

    the less tools/environments/Ide's one need's to access, the better it
    is. For the same reason, I liked the idea of "eclipse-ing" kettle a
    lot too, although I understood from earlier communications on the list
    that that would be hard at this moment.

    kind regards,

    --
    Roland Bouman

    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

  3. #3
    Matt Casters Guest

    Default RE: Get rid of Chef?

    Hi Roland,

    I do appreciate your opinion a lot and I guess you hit the target again
    here.

    Most of you probably guessed by now that the latest changes are small steps
    into the direction of the Eclipsification of Kettle.
    All the tabs in Spoon will become views in the RCP/Plugin.

    So yes, we'll give the RCP thang another go after the dev summit.
    We can talk about it there too I guess :-)

    Cheers,
    Matt

    -----Original Message-----
    From: kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    [mailto:kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com] On Behalf Of Roland Bouman
    Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 11:23 PM
    To: kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    Subject: Re: Get rid of Chef?


    Happy new year!

    Uhm...feels odd to be the first one to dig in, but I'd say: Go for It!

    the less tools/environments/Ide's one need's to access, the better it is.
    For the same reason, I liked the idea of "eclipse-ing" kettle a lot too,
    although I understood from earlier communications on the list that that
    would be hard at this moment.

    kind regards,

    --
    Roland Bouman




    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

  4. #4
    Chris Lavigne Guest

    Default RE: Get rid of Chef?

    Replace it, as long as the "Eclipsification of Kettle" doesn't mean Kettle becomes accessible only to java developers. One of the features that makes Kettle the best tool in the pentaho suite is ease of use.

    From my perspective I don't care if you triple the lines of java code if it makes Kettle even easier to use. I care more for the user experience...

    Matt Casters <mcasters (AT) pentaho (DOT) org> wrote:


    Hi Roland,

    I do appreciate your opinion a lot and I guess you hit the target again
    here.

    Most of you probably guessed by now that the latest changes are small steps
    into the direction of the Eclipsification of Kettle.
    All the tabs in Spoon will become views in the RCP/Plugin.

    So yes, we'll give the RCP thang another go after the dev summit.
    We can talk about it there too I guess :-)

    Cheers,
    Matt

    -----Original Message-----
    From: kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    [mailto:kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com] On Behalf Of Roland Bouman
    Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 11:23 PM
    To: kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    Subject: Re: Get rid of Chef?


    Happy new year!

    Uhm...feels odd to be the first one to dig in, but I'd say: Go for It!

    the less tools/environments/Ide's one need's to access, the better it is.
    For the same reason, I liked the idea of "eclipse-ing" kettle a lot too,
    although I understood from earlier communications on the list that that
    would be hard at this moment.

    kind regards,

    --
    Roland Bouman









    Chris Lavigne
    Breadboard Business Intelligence, LLC
    mobile: +1 925.922.9857 fax: +1-925-396-6093
    email: chris_lavigne (AT) breadboardbi (DOT) com skype: lavigne.kct
    web: http://www.breadboardbi.com
    Data Design * ETL * Cubes * Dashboards * Reports * Data Mining
    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

  5. #5
    Sven Boden Guest

    Default Re: Get rid of Chef?

    Also no problem with getting rid of Chef... also not that big a fan of
    porting spoon to Eclipse. I dabbled with plug-ins a bit in the past,
    they give more headaches than the GUI libraries currently in use (for
    developers).

    Regards,
    Sven


    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

  6. #6
    Matt Casters Guest

    Default RE: Get rid of Chef?

    Ah yes, but the lure of perspectives and dragable windows is sometimes hard
    to resist.
    I'm just making it all a bit more modular and I hope that I can "edge" a bit
    more in that direction.

    I'm not sure usability is an issue. With RCP you can lock the application
    down in such a way that it would look exactly like Spoon looks right now.
    In theory it's just a perspective that needs to be applied
    However, more advanced users would be able to unlock that, run in Eclipse,
    tie it in with other Pentaho tools, etc.

    I too dislike the OOSP (Object Oriented Spaghetti Programming) used in the
    Eclipse RCP/plugin framework, but the lure is still there.

    Finally, it's also something that Pentaho is wanting to have. That being
    said, I've been kinda dragging my feet with this for a while now, I can drag
    a bit longer ;-)

    All the best,

    Matt


    -----Original Message-----
    From: kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    [mailto:kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com] On Behalf Of Sven Boden
    Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 8:06 AM
    To: kettle-developers
    Subject: Re: Get rid of Chef?


    Also no problem with getting rid of Chef... also not that big a fan of
    porting spoon to Eclipse. I dabbled with plug-ins a bit in the past, they
    give more headaches than the GUI libraries currently in use (for
    developers).

    Regards,
    Sven





    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

  7. #7
    nicholas guzaldo Guest

    Default Re: Get rid of Chef?

    This is an interesting line of thought and I would like to share my
    thoughts, hope no one minds.

    I definitely see the lure in moving spoon to run in eclipse that way you can
    open the design studio and build your Pentaho product in one spot from
    production to warehouse to reporting to dashboard. Switching perspectives
    for what you are working on ie transformation jobs/transactions, xaction,
    monderian schema editing, report designing, etc is a thought of bless in my
    mind. But Pentaho has already introduced other "gui"s to help decentralize
    the development as it stands so using spoon and chef is not that big of a
    deal IMO. But combining them to make it easier for the developers to
    continue the great innovation by handling less lines of code. I cannot see
    how that would be bad.

    Spool is extremal user friendly and adding additional functionality so that
    one wouldn't need to switch between chef and spoon when building and editing
    the transactions used in a job. I would think by eliminating chef and
    adding that function to spoon would allow newer users to pick it up
    quicker. From my experience there was a little confusion on my part of what
    all the tools actual do and what are they used for. My first attempts were
    using spoon, pan, a bash script, and cron then I opened up chef and
    discovered quartz which I felt a bit ignorant for working with it the way I
    did. And Roland did say it well the less tools to open the better.

    I would say for when the timing would be right to move spoon/chef over to
    eclipse would be when other application from Pentaho would be doing the same
    or when innovation has slowed. GUIs such as the cube designer, report
    wizard, report designer, spoon, etc all start to become additional
    perspectives and wizards in eclipse which would definently help the over all
    experience when developing a product. But until then one or two extra tools
    just extends the learning curve slightly if at all.

    My last thought is to do whats best for innovation!

    Hopefully my thoughts will help,

    Nic

    On 1/4/07, Matt Casters <mcasters (AT) pentaho (DOT) org> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > Ah yes, but the lure of perspectives and dragable windows is sometimes
    > hard
    > to resist.
    > I'm just making it all a bit more modular and I hope that I can "edge" a
    > bit
    > more in that direction.
    >
    > I'm not sure usability is an issue. With RCP you can lock the application
    > down in such a way that it would look exactly like Spoon looks right now.
    > In theory it's just a perspective that needs to be applied
    > However, more advanced users would be able to unlock that, run in Eclipse,
    > tie it in with other Pentaho tools, etc.
    >
    > I too dislike the OOSP (Object Oriented Spaghetti Programming) used in the
    > Eclipse RCP/plugin framework, but the lure is still there.
    >
    > Finally, it's also something that Pentaho is wanting to have. That being
    > said, I've been kinda dragging my feet with this for a while now, I can
    > drag
    > a bit longer ;-)
    >
    > All the best,
    >
    > Matt
    >
    >
    > -----Original Message-----
    > From: kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    > [mailto:kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com] On Behalf Of Sven Boden
    > Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 8:06 AM
    > To: kettle-developers
    > Subject: Re: Get rid of Chef?
    >
    >
    > Also no problem with getting rid of Chef... also not that big a fan of
    > porting spoon to Eclipse. I dabbled with plug-ins a bit in the past, they
    > give more headaches than the GUI libraries currently in use (for
    > developers).
    >
    > Regards,
    > Sven
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > >

    >


    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

  8. #8
    sven.thiergen Guest

    Default Re: Get rid of Chef?

    A big plus for combining Chef and Spoon! Indeed most users will find it
    irritating to have 2 applications for one tool, although the developer
    may understand the motivation for splitting both. And a lot of effort
    is saved when making a bugfix / improvement for Chef or Spoon and you
    won't have to do it for the other as well.

    So as said before, there cannot be anything wrong with it.

    Well, maybe just that one will have even more icons now, as the Job
    steps will need to be included with the Spoon steps. But that's just a
    minor problem ...


    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

  9. #9
    Biswapesh Chattopadhyay Guest

    Default Re: Get rid of Chef?

    +1

    I would like to add though that I would be very interested in adding
    more features to the job scheduling backend. For example, currently,
    it is quite tricky to have a complex scheduling / dependency
    management in Chef. I would also like to see more powerful variable
    substitutions, ability to run jobs in parallel in single and multiple
    machines, etc.

    HTH

    Rgds,
    Biswa.


    On 04/01/07, sven.thiergen <s.thiergen (AT) itcampus (DOT) de> wrote:
    >
    > A big plus for combining Chef and Spoon! Indeed most users will find it
    > irritating to have 2 applications for one tool, although the developer
    > may understand the motivation for splitting both. And a lot of effort
    > is saved when making a bugfix / improvement for Chef or Spoon and you
    > won't have to do it for the other as well.
    >
    > So as said before, there cannot be anything wrong with it.
    >
    > Well, maybe just that one will have even more icons now, as the Job
    > steps will need to be included with the Spoon steps. But that's just a
    > minor problem ...
    >
    >
    > >

    >


    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

  10. #10
    Matt Casters Guest

    Default RE: Get rid of Chef?

    This is another interesting topic.
    The way I would like to solve this is with the definition of "resources",
    resource "bundles" and "dependencies".
    That way you can evolve towards something that figures out all by itself in
    which order to perform certain tasks.

    Example of resources the way I see it are files, database tables,
    transformations, jobs, etc. (pretty much anything)
    The concept bundles are very usefull to do versioning on later. You can
    "tag" collections of resources with it.

    It also becomes very easy at that point to give warnings in the style:

    You can't load fact table "Sales" because dimension "Dim_Customer"
    can't be loaded.
    The "Dim_Customer" dimension can't be loaded because the
    "S_Customer" source table couldn't be loaded.
    The source table "S_Customer" couldn't be loaded because the source
    file "abcd.txt" is not available.

    The trick will be to find the correct (read: simple) visual designer for all
    this.
    I'm thinking it could/should be a separate designer from Jobs &
    Transformations.

    Thoughts?

    Matt



    -----Original Message-----
    From: kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    [mailto:kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com] On Behalf Of Biswapesh
    Chattopadhyay
    Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 3:12 PM
    To: kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    Subject: Re: Get rid of Chef?


    +1

    I would like to add though that I would be very interested in adding more
    features to the job scheduling backend. For example, currently, it is quite
    tricky to have a complex scheduling / dependency management in Chef. I would
    also like to see more powerful variable substitutions, ability to run jobs
    in parallel in single and multiple machines, etc.

    HTH

    Rgds,
    Biswa.


    On 04/01/07, sven.thiergen <s.thiergen (AT) itcampus (DOT) de> wrote:
    >
    > A big plus for combining Chef and Spoon! Indeed most users will find
    > it irritating to have 2 applications for one tool, although the
    > developer may understand the motivation for splitting both. And a lot
    > of effort is saved when making a bugfix / improvement for Chef or
    > Spoon and you won't have to do it for the other as well.
    >
    > So as said before, there cannot be anything wrong with it.
    >
    > Well, maybe just that one will have even more icons now, as the Job
    > steps will need to be included with the Spoon steps. But that's just a
    > minor problem ...
    >
    >
    > >

    >





    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "kettle-developers" group.
    To post to this group, send email to kettle-developers (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
    To unsubscribe from this group, send email to kettle-developers-unsubscribe (AT) g...oups (DOT) com
    For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/kettle-developers?hl=en
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Privacy Policy | Legal Notices | Safe Harbor Privacy Policy

Copyright © 2005 - 2019 Hitachi Vantara Corporation. All Rights Reserved.