Hitachi Vantara Pentaho Community Forums
Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: CDF Presentation.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,497

    Post CDF Presentation.

    I recently conducted a CDF presentation with the help of Daniel Einspanjer.


    Its a very brief talk about about Dashboards, the history and current state of cdf, and our view on the future.


    The link is here:
    http://www.webdetails.pt/pentaho/web...ntation-v1.pdf


    We're working on the final bits to try to release CDF 3 soon
    Pedro Alves
    Meet us on ##pentaho, a FreeNode irc channel

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    11

    Default

    Pedro,

    Until page 7 you almost convinced that it was a "simple" product. =)
    Firstly, a simple product does not require "Html, Css and JavaScript only (no jsp/xml/xslt)", as you stated. Have you ever seen Panorama Dashboards, for instance? You may extend it with javascript, but you need only a few clicks to create dashboards. That is to focus on conceptual difficulties.

    A dashboard designer product or tool must not require any technical skills. Even with CDF, is not possible for anyone outside the "java-world" to use it. Please, be honest: do you think that someone that only knows "HTML, Css and javascript" will EVER be able to download Pentaho+CDF and start creating beautiful dashboards?

    "CDF is a real-world driven project aimed at allowing the developers to focus not on the technical but on the conceptual difficulties of dashboard building". pg 5
    In my opinion, the main point is: dashboard building should not require a developer at all. That's why I think the entire Pentaho product is not well-balanced. Why investing so much in a complex "action" stuff and leave out a key part of any BI solution?

    I do appreciate you effort, and I hope you continue with the product. I just don't like the "it is not that complex" behavior. I could not find any decent documentation, I have a meeting tomorrow, and I am afraid I won't able to offer Pentaho dashboards so soon.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,497

    Default

    I don't disagree with you.

    That presentation was made for Pentaho, and don't forget that the alternatives on the pentaho world are .jsp based dashboards. It was never my intention to compare it with other commercial alternatives; this is, after all, a community effort.

    You would definetly never find any documentation over what's on the presentation, since it was not released yet; We plan to release CDF 3.0 this week; After that, you'll tell me what you think. But it will still be for *developers*, not the final user.
    Pedro Alves
    Meet us on ##pentaho, a FreeNode irc channel

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    8,085

    Default

    simple product does not require "Html, Css and JavaScript only (no jsp/xml/xslt)"
    Lets make that business friendly:

    CDF is a product that integrates well with all existing legacy applications that may exist in your enterprise. No matter whether you run a RPG/400, ASP or PHP portal, you will be able to use CDF with minimal impact on your existing infrastructure and without a large increase in the IT-costs of your company.
    ... not be used outside the Java-World ...
    The trick is: CDF is not based on Java. Its based only on JavaScript and HTML/CSS. Any web-developer that worked with these 3 standards can use it. They dont have to use Java, they may not even have heard of Java and would still be able to use it.

    They may need additional knowledge, like how to create Cubes, how to make a metadata model, or how to write an XAction, but again: None of these tasks requires Java knowledge. It requires knowledge about multi-dimensional modeling or certain domain specific knowledge, like how to create XActions, but no Java. The Cube and Metadata model usually will be made by highly paid consultants, you dont want your pointy haired boss mess with that task. The XActions part will probably only be needed if you have special needs, and special needs always translates to "getting someone who is trained for it". So given a situation where you have a cube and metadata model ready to use, you should be able to give the CDF to any capable web-developer and he should come back with a sane solution.

    Firstly, a simple product does not require "Html, Css and JavaScript only (no jsp/xml/xslt)", as you stated.
    I disagree. The dashboard product you mentioned would not work if you disable JavaScript in the browser. So it *needs* JavaScript. The question is: Do you have to expose JavaScript to the end-user?

    The backend of any technical system has nothing to do whether you can make a nice UI on top of it. MS Office now also uses XML as data format and still I haven't heard anyone crying "oh no, now Office will only be usable by technical people and developers. The sky is falling!". CDF is now a clean beast, with a nice component oriented architecture, so I would say its now easy to create a end-user-friendly UI on top of that.

    CDF aims to be a backend product, so providing a UI is less a priority. I bet the community wont rest until there is a designer on top of CDF, but thats beyond the scope of CDF today.


    And finally:

    For the first few releases, concentrating on developers is fine, I would say, if that allows you to make a superior product. Concentrate on users you dont know and your product will suck. After the first years, you should know better where and how your product is used, and then it becomes naturally easy to make a UI that fits your target market.

    As the Pentaho Platform aims at large companies, concentrating on developers first is not a show-stopper at all. If you - by using our product instead of using a expensive closed-source one - save $50k per year, then you can easily pay a developer from those savings and still be at break even. And that does not count in the fact that this developer delivers results that are tailored to fit to your needs, a thing that gets even more expensive if you have to work with off-the-shelf software. Of course, the license costs for BI-tools usually is a lot higher than $50k, so you can probably hire 2 or 3 and still have savings left.
    Get the latest news and tips and tricks for Pentaho Reporting at the Pentaho Reporting Blog.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    4

    Default CDF sample not loading

    Hey...

    I just downloaded and installed the CDF 3.0 version, which came as a .jar installer. When I try to load the sample dashboards in it, nothing loads. I have been waiting for nearly 30 mins for the Pentaho Sample to load. I have waited for more than 5 mins for all the dashboards that I tried. What could be the issue? Could it be something wrong with the installation, or is it usually slow?

    Another question I have is, if I have a 1.6 version manually configured for tomcat, can I still use the CDF with that?
    Last edited by jashjacob; 01-29-2009 at 05:50 AM. Reason: Adding one more question.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,497

    Default

    You need to give more informations there regarding pentaho/cdf version, os, java version..

    All samples take about.... 3 seconds to load
    Pedro Alves
    Meet us on ##pentaho, a FreeNode irc channel

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,497

    Default

    You need to give more informations there regarding pentaho/cdf version, os, java version..

    All samples take about.... 3 seconds to load

    And cdf 3.0 dusseldorf is for version 1.7 (and the installer will run only for java >= 1.5)
    Pedro Alves
    Meet us on ##pentaho, a FreeNode irc channel

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    4

    Default

    OS is Windows XP Professional edition

    CDF 3.0

    Java version : Java2RE Standard Edition (build 1.5....)

  9. #9

    Default

    Hi pmalves,

    i am also facing the same problem that the samples file from CDF 3.0 is not loaded, even after showing the processing .gif for a very long time. i can only see the words from HTML(Eg, "Select a Region")
    i have no problem running the installer as i have successfully install it and i am using windows xp professional.

    does that means that if i am using Pentaho BI Server Community Edition Version 2.0, i will not be able to use CDF 3.0 ?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,497

    Default

    When that happens, you should see either a javascript error (best detected using firefox with firebug) or a error in pentaho's logs.

    cdf 3.0 lisbon is for version 2.0.0.stable, so it should definitely work
    Pedro Alves
    Meet us on ##pentaho, a FreeNode irc channel

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Privacy Policy | Legal Notices | Safe Harbor Privacy Policy

Copyright © 2005 - 2019 Hitachi Vantara Corporation. All Rights Reserved.